81 replies to this topic

[folkeye]

Okay, I have my new Rebel T3i and am so far very happy with it. I've been driving it in auto-mode for now until I start a photography class in September (helps me get a feel for the camera). So far in auto, everything has been pretty darn nice. Things were crisp, different focal lengths looked nice and clean...until last weekend.

Took the camera to attempt some birding, and did the auto thing.... this time they looked terrible, blurry. Even a Dark Eyed Junco on the ground less than 10 feet from me ended up bad and I have no clue why, or what I did. My theory is that I pushed my lens to 250mm most the time (its the 55-250mm) and that may have caused the not so desirable shots, but doesn't explain the close up of the Junco. Also need to get that flash off, kept wanting to pop up with adequate light. Maybe that had something to do with it too, it was daytime in minor shade.

I'm unable to manually focus. I did try, but fail miserably to get my subject in focus (can't even tell when subject is in focus in the first place, but can see foreground/background ok). Probably doing something wrong there too.


For driving on auto pilot for now anybody have any suggestions for birding what setting would work best? Portrait, sports, landscape that type of thing? I know sports and portrait had worked well at the pier for the not so fast birds, but apparently not for smaller subjects further away of course.

Made me sad since it was a lot of lost opportunity my point and shoot could have handled better Was in my pocket but I was excited to use the better camera if I could.

Oh, just for reference here was one of the Junco shots (not the worst of the bunch)...if you look at the larger size you can see the not so crispness around the head. The bird wasn't moving much, and my lens wasn't pushed out that far.



Dark Eyed Junco by notrufus, on Flickr

VS the Sparrow that came out better, further away... again, both on auto...



White-crowned Sparrow by notrufus, on Flickr

[meghann]

OK, I looked at the EXIF data, and I think for the junco, you were TOO close to it for the camera to focus. If you had zoomed out just a little, he probably would have been in focus.

Also, do me a favor, and you know those "portrait" and "landscape" settings? Forget they exist. In Auto and all of those modes, it's going to want to use the flash, and you really want to avoid using on camera flash as much as humanly possible. Either shoot in "P" mode on your dial, watching lighting, and bump your ISO as needed to prevent blur. OR, take the next baby step and shoot in Aperture priority mode. It's not scary, I promise. Decide how much of a photo you want in focus, and set your aperture accordingly. (A little, with a lot of blurry background, choose a smaller number. A lot in focus, including the background, choose a higher number.) The camera will choose your shutter speed, but again, you want to keep an eye on that shutter speed, and if it gets low, you want to bump up your ISO.

[folkeye]

Aperture priority isn't so scary, thankfully (considering I know where it is at least), will remember to give that a go. Next time I try not to be so close either.

Now how about being far enough to have to push the 250mm (again, in auto). Would that cause a horrible blur? I THINK both of these were on auto focus. These two were put together in Photoshop so the camera info isn't there, can upload some untouched shots later tonight.



Oak Titmouse by notrufus, on Flickr

Too dark and too much movement for the camera to decide maybe? Got so many blurr-dees from this weekend.

[TheBillyPilgrim]

Aperture priority isn't so scary, thankfully (considering I know where it is at least), will remember to give that a go. Next time I try not to be so close either.

Now how about being far enough to have to push the 250mm (again, in auto). Would that cause a horrible blur? I THINK both of these were on auto focus. These two were put together in Photoshop so the camera info isn't there, can upload some untouched shots later tonight.



Oak Titmouse by notrufus, on Flickr

Too dark and too much movement for the camera to decide maybe? Got so many blurr-dees from this weekend.

My guess on those shots is that the bird was moving to much/too fast for the autofocus to lock in and properly get all of the image you wanted. The low light level probably compounded the problem, since it likely wouldn't allow for the fastest shutter speeds.

[meghann]

Yeah my guess on those two, is not enough light/too slow shutter speed for the first shot, and the bird just moving fast in the second. How I'm differentiating the two is based on whether the tree branch below the bird is in focus or not. In the first shot, your whole shot is blurry, in the second, just the bird is.

[folkeye]

Yeah my guess on those two, is not enough light/too slow shutter speed for the first shot, and the bird just moving fast in the second. How I'm differentiating the two is based on whether the tree branch below the bird is in focus or not. In the first shot, your whole shot is blurry, in the second, just the bird is.

Hmm, then the chance is perhaps on the fully blur picture I tired manually focusing in a non-proper mode (couldn't tell when anything was in focus.)

[TheBillyPilgrim]

Hmm, then the chance is perhaps on the fully blur picture I tired manually focusing in a non-proper mode (couldn't tell when anything was in focus.)

Yeah, I don't think the first image is camera shake (resulting from too slow of a shutter speed). Looks more like the whole focus was just off a bit.

[meghann]

ok, I looked again and you're right. That first one in the second set it more unfocused than camera shake. The second one is the bird's fault, though. Lol! (It's kind of a neat effect with the wings if you look at the original size image, though!)

[folkeye]

This'll be a silly question, but I must ask.

Can you use manual focus in something like portrait mode? Or is that reserved fully for the other more functional modes?

...got lots to learn I do.

[Joejr14]

Honestly, most of those 'modes' suck. But yes, you can manual focus (should be an override switch on the lens) in any 'mode'.

The Junco image is camera shake. You were at 250mm and 1/200 of a second. If you're hand-holding that's going to be camera shake EVERY time unless you're a super steady person holding a camera.

A good 'rule' until you get more practice under your belt (especially hand-held) is for your shutter speed to be 2x your focal length. If you're going to shoot at 250mm try to get your shutter speed to 1/500 of a second. This is why many of those 'modes' suck--as does auto. It limits you being able to set the shutter speed, aperture or ISO when situations call for it.

Honestly, I'd try to dive into full manual mode ASAP. It's a steeper learning curve, but once you 'get it' it makes life SOOOO much easier.

[folkeye]

Honestly, most of those 'modes' suck. But yes, you can manual focus (should be an override switch on the lens) in any 'mode'.

The Junco image is camera shake. You were at 250mm and 1/200 of a second. If you're hand-holding that's going to be camera shake EVERY time unless you're a super steady person holding a camera.

A good 'rule' until you get more practice under your belt (especially hand-held) is for your shutter speed to be 2x your focal length. If you're going to shoot at 250mm try to get your shutter speed to 1/500 of a second. This is why many of those 'modes' suck--as does auto. It limits you being able to set the shutter speed, aperture or ISO when situations call for it.

Honestly, I'd try to dive into full manual mode ASAP. It's a steeper learning curve, but once you 'get it' it makes life SOOOO much easier.

Yeah I know. I'll get there one of these days. All that mathematical stuff makes my brain hurt, so I know it'll be a while before I get it (aka shutter speed vs focal length, foreign language stuff).

I know I'm going to aim for some better pictures of Bald Eagles in a few weeks. Most will be sitting in trees/on buildings for a mostly easy shot. Flying would be nice, but not holding my breath. Would working in aperture priority be something doable? Or shutter priority? There's a chance of cloudy weather as usual.

Having a faster shutter speed makes better stills, right?

[meghann]

Having a faster shutter speed makes better stills, right?

Yes, you usually want to aim for the highest shutter speed possible, however the faster the shutter speed, the less light is let in with each shot. So if it's cloudy, or you're in a forest, or the sun is setting, etc., if you want to keep fast shutter speeds you have to either open up your aperture (and lose depth of field) and/or bump your ISO higher.

[folkeye]

Yes, you usually want to aim for the highest shutter speed possible, however the faster the shutter speed, the less light is let in with each shot. So if it's cloudy, or you're in a forest, or the sun is setting, etc., if you want to keep fast shutter speeds you have to either open up your aperture (and lose depth of field) and/or bump your ISO higher.

Gotcha. So if I wanted to play around in aperture priority and just manually adjust the shutter speed, would that be a decent place to start?

[meghann]

Well, aperture priority is where you pick the aperture, and the camera picks a shutter speed. If you want to just play around with shutter speed, do shutter priority, and then the camera will pick an aperture for you.

You can also start in one of the priority modes, and then switch to manual for a few shots. Example- you know you want to shoot at 1/1000, so you pick shutter priority, and choose that. Take note of the aperture the camera picked for that speed. Then switch to manual, put in 1/1000 for your shutter speed, and then fire off a few shots with different aperture settings. Then later, you can look through them and see how that affected things.

[lonestranger]

This is how I started experimenting with aperture priority, which I now use 90% of the time. I set my aperture to the smallest possible number, which allows the most light through the lens which provides the fastest possible shutter speed. I would set my ISO at 400 and then take a test shot similar to shooting a bird. I would review my test shot and see how fast my shutter speed was. Since I selected the aperture and ISO myself, the only variable for the camera to adjust is the shutter speed. If the shutter speed was less than 1/500s I would raise my ISO which would give me a faster shutter speed. If my shutter speed was way over 1/500s I would lower my ISO to find a suitable shutter speed. If my ISO was low enough and my shutter speed was fast enough, then and only then would I adjust my aperture to the higher numbers. After selecting my aperture, the only adjustment I would make was to the ISO setting which in turn would affect my shutter speed. This is all related to bird photography of course and is just a generalization but a decent place to start.

If you use aperture or shutter priority, I would strongly suggest controlling the ISO yourself to influence how the camera handles the other variable. By setting two of the three variables yourself, your camera has less room for choosing the wrong settings to get the right exposure.

[Joejr14]

Yeah I know. I'll get there one of these days. All that mathematical stuff makes my brain hurt, so I know it'll be a while before I get it (aka shutter speed vs focal length, foreign language stuff).

I know I'm going to aim for some better pictures of Bald Eagles in a few weeks. Most will be sitting in trees/on buildings for a mostly easy shot. Flying would be nice, but not holding my breath. Would working in aperture priority be something doable? Or shutter priority? There's a chance of cloudy weather as usual.

Having a faster shutter speed makes better stills, right?

Have fun with the eagles....but stay away from auto. That will mess your images up like you've never seen. The cameras exposure 'brains' aren't smart enough to deal with eagles---exposure equations are all formulated on 'greys', not blacks and whites. Auto mode will either over-expose the head, or way under-expose the blacks (ie expose the body properly (blowing the exposure on the head), or expose the head properly (under-exposing the body)).

You can do it in aperture priority, but you'll need to control ISO and you might need to dial in some exposure compensation too.

[canon eos]

Okay, I have my new Rebel T3i and am so far very happy with it. I've been driving it in auto-mode for now until I start a photography class..............

It looks like you are doing well so far, and that you are are serious about getting good bird photos. I would strongly suggest getting a book or two on photography. Perhaps bird photography, sometime, but a book on general photography. It will pay dividends many times over.
With today's very competent cameras it is quite easy to get the odd excellent image, and even in Auto mode one can nail it from time to time. But to do your best it is important to understand the basics.

[folkeye]

It looks like you are doing well so far, and that you are are serious about getting good bird photos. I would strongly suggest getting a book or two on photography. Perhaps bird photography, sometime, but a book on general photography. It will pay dividends many times over.
With today's very competent cameras it is quite easy to get the odd excellent image, and even in Auto mode one can nail it from time to time. But to do your best it is important to understand the basics.

Yeah, wrapping my brain around some of the basics first is a bit of a chore

Looking forward to my class though, assuming it happens, adult night courses can sometimes get iffy if not enough sign ups. Sounds like it starts at square one, which is what I need. Apply square one, move on to square 2 and so forth. Doing different assignments w/ different subject matter with what we just learned will help a lot to get things sink in more. I can book learn 'ok'. Uniting that learning with practice is the hard part.

[folkeye]

Have fun with the eagles....but stay away from auto. That will mess your images up like you've never seen. The cameras exposure 'brains' aren't smart enough to deal with eagles---exposure equations are all formulated on 'greys', not blacks and whites. Auto mode will either over-expose the head, or way under-expose the blacks (ie expose the body properly (blowing the exposure on the head), or expose the head properly (under-exposing the body)).

You can do it in aperture priority, but you'll need to control ISO and you might need to dial in some exposure compensation too.

Is there a better mode, outside of aperture to be in that won't be too overwhelming and 'quick' to adjust? I'm bummed since my mom's friend, who loves her photography is out of town the week I'm there. Would have been so much fun.

[canon eos]

Now I may be a slow learner (have no idea how I graduated as an engineer!) but it took me years to learn the basics of photography. I got book after book from the library, and read and tried out things.
Right now you have a camera (a very good one) and the manual, and.............
Unlike my film days, you can go out and shoot to your heart's content as there is no ongoing cost for media.
Your main modes are known as PASM, for Program, Aperture, Shutter and Manual. I would suggest staying away from P and M. And as your manual will say, the A and S are where you set the A (aperture) or S (shutter speed) and the brains in the camera will attempt (and usually does a very good job at) giving you a good exposure.

Get the manual out, read, shoot, within each Mode try the various apertures and shutter speeds.
Then upload to your computer and compare.
With a PC (non-Mac) I would recommend using FastStone to view your images; the EXIF will be at the right for you to do your comparisons.

enjoy