21 replies to this topic

[Shoveler26]

Hi all,
I quickley took this shot at Eagle creek park, Indianapolis, IN Last spring And was wondering could this be a Yellow-Palm Warbler? I know that is Uncommon in Indiana or is it a brown-Palm Warbler?


Thanks
,
Shoveler26

[The Sego Sago Kid]

Oops, forget it. You're asking about subspecies. My bad.

[Shoveler26]

Thanks but I already know it is a Palm Warbler. Is it a Yellow Palm Warbler or a Brown?

[BarnSwallow]

Yes, yellow (eastern warbler).

[Shoveler26]

Wow! Awesome That is Really Rare for the area! We usually get Brown (Western Warbler)! Thanks!

[TheBillyPilgrim]

Agreed. The full yellow supercilium points to the Eastern (yellow) subspecies.

[Shoveler26]

That is awesome! Have anyone (In the Midwest) Ever seen a Yellow palm warbler? If so Are they regular in the midwest?

[Liam]

Agreed. The full yellow supercilium points to the Eastern (yellow) subspecies.

I agree, yellow superciulium and malar point to Eastern. Nice sighting! I believe there were a few reports in the midwest this Spring.

[Shoveler26]

Would you consider it a "rare" Sighting?

[TheBillyPilgrim]

Would you consider it a "rare" Sighting?

Definitely. It's outside the normal migratory route. Nice find

[cestma]

That is awesome! Have anyone (In the Midwest) Ever seen a Yellow palm warbler? If so Are they regular in the midwest?

Cool sighting! Have you checked eBird records for your area? You might want to post your find there.

[psweet]

Agreed -- I've never seen one of the eastern birds that I'm aware of! Nice find!!

[syncrasy]

The full yellow supercilium points to the Eastern (yellow) subspecies.

I could be wrong, but since this is a spring bird, a yellow supercilium might not be the most reliable field mark. According to my field guides, a Western (brown) Palm Warbler can have a yellow supercilium in the spring too. Wouldn't the more extensive and brighter yellow underparts be the more reliable field mark for a spring Eastern (yellow) subspecies?

[TheBillyPilgrim]

I could be wrong, but since this is a spring bird, a yellow supercilium might not be the most reliable field mark. According to my field guides, a Western (brown) Palm Warbler can have a yellow supercilium in the spring too. Wouldn't the more extensive and brighter yellow underparts be the more reliable field mark for a spring Eastern (yellow) subspecies?

I'm not sure if you are doubting the ID or just critiquing my mark, but here goes...

I've never seen a western-race with that much yellow on the supercilium (they aren't always that dull tan color, but never this vibrant yellow), plus the extensive amount across the face and throat clinch it as an Eastern.

[syncrasy]

I'm not sure if you are doubting the ID or just critiquing my mark, but here goes...

I've never seen a western-race with that much yellow on the supercilium (they aren't always that dull tan color, but never this vibrant yellow), plus the extensive amount across the face and throat clinch it as an Eastern.

No, I'm not doubting the ID. I'm just wondering if the supercilium mark is really the most reliable mark for separating the two subspecies in the spring. The reasons for my doubt are the illustrations in the Warblers field guide by Dunn/Garrett and a Palm Warbler I photographed in Illinois in the spring (see below). It's presumably a western (brown) bird, but the yellow on the face and supercilium appear to be bright yellow to me. I don't have a lot of field experience with either subspecies, so I don't know if this is typical or atypical. But I do wonder if the critical difference is the extent of yellow in the chest and belly (vs. just the supercilium and throat).

[cestma]

What a lovely shot, syncrasy!

[TheBillyPilgrim]

No, I'm not doubting the ID. I'm just wondering if the supercilium mark is really the most reliable mark for separating the two subspecies in the spring. The reasons for my doubt are the illustrations in the Warblers field guide by Dunn/Garrett and a Palm Warbler I photographed in Illinois in the spring (see below). It's a western (brown) bird, but the yellow on the face and supercilium appear to be bright yellow to me. I don't have a lot of field experience with either subspecies, so I don't know if this is typical or atypical. But as you suggest above, perhaps a critical difference is the extent of yellow in the throat (not so much in my bird; a lot in the Eastern birds).

You raise a good point. According to BNA, Western birds should never show a bright yellow supercilium (only faint yellow in alternate plumage). Your photo is definitely more yellow than I'd ever seen on a Western (I'd call the portion before the eye "bright") but I guess the distinguishing factor is the rear fading to white. (in addition to the clear contrast between the throat/undetail coverts and underparts). Browsing around, I found several other photos similar to yours, so it isn't aberrant.

Personally, I'm used to dealing with basic plumaged birds, where the supercilium really helps and I'd never thought much about it being less useful in alternate plumage. Thanks for bringing it up

EDIT: Oh, and I forgot to compliment the beautiful shot of the Palm!

[syncrasy]

Thanks, cestma and TBP. Sometimes one just gets lucky with a camera. That day was one of those times.

TBP... it's strange that the BNA would say that, since its sister site, All About Birds, shows a western bird with a very bright yellow supercilium front to back (i.e., not much fade).

http://www.allaboutb...Palm_Warbler/id

[TheBillyPilgrim]

Thanks, cestma and TBP. Sometimes one just gets lucky with a camera. That day was one of those times.

TBP... it's strange that the BNA would say that, since it's sister site, All About Birds, shows a western bird with a very bright yellow supercilium front to back (i.e., not much fade).

http://www.allaboutb...Palm_Warbler/id

Wow, that bird really shows it solidly yellow along the whole length. Here's their exact quote: "Also submustachial stripe and superciliary stripe are whitish (not yellow) in Basic plumage, but become light yellow in Alternate plumage." It doesn't mention anything about differences in color along the length. Definitely a contradiction there.

At the end of the day it's not really a huge ID issue, as the differences in alternate plumage are pretty striking between the two races but it's definitely something to consider on unique, confusing, or aberrant individuals!

[cestma]

Thanks, cestma and TBP. Sometimes one just gets lucky with a camera. That day was one of those times.

TBP... it's strange that the BNA would say that, since its sister site, All About Birds, shows a western bird with a very bright yellow supercilium front to back (i.e., not much fade).

You have to know what you're doing to "get lucky."

Chiming in to say that several months ago I also discovered a discrepancy between BNA & AAB regarding bird appearance. If I remember what species that was I'll let you know. In these cases I tend to trust BNA--look at all those references! Though I suppose one should pay attention to just how recent they are...