25 replies to this topic

[Revup67]

apparently both can have green backs and according to Sibley's they are difficult to tell apart except for broader wings on Rufous version.

Any experts out there? southern cal location about 1 mile from beach if that helps any. Found in largers tree not shrubs


Hummingbird - Creekside Park by Revup67, on Flickr

have a few more photos if needed

[Revup67]

Ok thanks Birdluvr..working on some other shots at the moment - will try and upload very soon

[Revup67]

Ok here's another photo from the backside..perhaps this will asist


Hummingbird - Creekside Park by Revup67, on Flickr

[Revup67]

And one more if it helps any


Hummingbird - Creekside Park by Revup67, on Flickr

[Revup67]

here's another. I too am convinced this is an Allen's. Thanks Birdluvr


Allen's Hummingbird Creekside Park by Revup67, on Flickr

[LittleBird]

Beautiful shots. I think all three of these shots are of different birds. The first has a fully colored gorget and rufous flanks, the second has just a patch of colored gorget and rufous flanks, the third also has only a patch of colored gorget and mostly white flanks. I think that means the first is a male, the second two are females. As to what species they are I am not qualified or comfortable to weigh in. Again, excellent shots!

[Revup67]

I am pretty sure its the same bird I was circling around the same bush and watched this bird for about 30 minutes. Though with my eye in the view finder anything is possible to happen right before my eyes especially with their speed. And where there's one, there's likely others.

here's one more shot. this is perhaps my favorite of the bunch.


Allen's Humminbird - Creekside Park by Revup67, on Flickr

[Revup67]

Birdluvr..it appears at this same park I've got mixed in here a few different birds though more than likely of the same species just check out the gorget on the first photo vs. the rest. much different - I appreciate all the assistance.

A few more photos at: http://www.flickr.com/revup67

[psweet]

Given that you're in Southern California where Allen's is expected, I'd have no trouble calling the first one an adult male Allen's. (If you want 100% certainty, you're going to have to catch one and measure the tail feathers, I'm afraid.) The others look like either immature males or females, and they're pretty much indistinguishable except in the hand.

[guy_incognito]

If you want a definite answer, you've definitely got Selasphorus hummingbirds. Rufous are back in So Cal now, just saw my first adult male at the feeder yesterday. Agree with psweet, the others all look like females or immature birds, so I wouldn't venture a guess on those.

Odds are strongly in favor of the the first bird being an Allen's, but you can't be 100% sure. Getting a good picture of it with spread tail feathers would be confirmatory.

[DaveWo]

I have no idea what type it is, but the camera work is gorgeous!

[TheBillyPilgrim]

thats definitely an allens

As Psweet and GuyIncognito pointed out, there's no way to ever be 100% on these birds without a great shot of the tail or the bird in hand.

[cany]

If you want a definite answer, you've definitely got Selasphorus hummingbirds. Rufous are back in So Cal now, just saw my first adult male at the feeder yesterday. Agree with psweet, the others all look like females or immature birds, so I wouldn't venture a guess on those.

Odds are strongly in favor of the the first bird being an Allen's, but you can't be 100% sure. Getting a good picture of it with spread tail feathers would be confirmatory.

That is one incredible shot!

And Rev, very nice photos as usual. I have a feeling we'll cross paths one of these days:) I keep a look out for a big 400mm lens:)

[creeker]

If you want a definite answer, you've definitely got Selasphorus hummingbirds. Rufous are back in So Cal now, just saw my first adult male at the feeder yesterday. Agree with psweet, the others all look like females or immature birds, so I wouldn't venture a guess on those.

Odds are strongly in favor of the the first bird being an Allen's, but you can't be 100% sure. Getting a good picture of it with spread tail feathers would be confirmatory.

guy_ you never fail to amaze me!

[darknight]

those are all allens. some are immature, some females but all allens. theres too much green in them for rufous. i know people say male rufous can have green on them, which is true but if they do have green, its normally just flecks of green, if at all,and females on the other hand can have more green on them but i still believe they are all allens.

The female and immatures of both species have all green backs, and are indistinguishable from each other by plumage You'll find this supported by all major field guides and hummingbird experts. It's tough, because we birders always want to put a name to every bird we see, but in this case that's just not possible. There is just no way of reliably identifying females and immatures by plumage.


Here's some good links with more info on the topic, discussing that fact that there is apparently overlap in the back color of even adult males, (including some bird that were adult male rufous hummingbirds by measurement, but showed greater than 95% green backs!).
http://texasbirds.or...llenshummt.html
http://home.pacifier...HUMMREPORT.html
http://www.hummingbi...net/rufous.html

[TheBillyPilgrim]

those are all allens. some are immature, some females but all allens. theres too much green in them for rufous. i know people say male rufous can have green on them, which is true but if they do have green, its normally just flecks of green, if at all,and females on the other hand can have more green on them but i still believe they are all allens.

Sorry Birdluvr, but this logic is incorrect and poor information. Some male rufous are essentially identical to Allen's in the amount of green they show, and the females and immatures are indistinguishable outside of tail feather shape. I suggest doing some reading on the subject (Darknight provided some great links) to better understand the nuances of these challenging IDs.